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hobby caravans again
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hobby caravans again
10 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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deke
Joined 10 Feb 2003
20 posts
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following on from marts enquiry we are about to buy a german spec imported hobby 560kmfe single axle which is 2.5 metres wide and 1600kg in weight we have been assured that our shogun can pull this and have recieved quotes for insurance from a couple of companies. but now we're worried that it might not be legal to tow in the u.k. Though we,ve heard that under e.u law it is. any advice gratefully recieved
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hobby caravans again
11 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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Alan
Joined 8 Apr 2002
68 posts
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To be able to tow a trailer exceeding 2.3m wide in this country your towing vehicle must have a maximum gross weight EXCEEDING 3500Kg. i.e. a commercial vehicle, not even the new Range Rover exceeds 3500Kg so a Shogun won't. If you want confirmation of this ring one of the CLubs technical dept.
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hobby caravans again
11 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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Alan
Joined 8 Apr 2002
68 posts
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According to the Caravan Club Technical Dept. the max width of a caravan to be towed behind a 'heavy motor vehicle' is 2.3m. If you want to tow up to 2.5m wide the towing vehicle must have a maximum gross weight EXCEEDING 3500Kg, i.e. a commercial vehicle as no 4x4 I know of quote a max figure greater than 3500Kg.
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hobby caravans again
11 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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gary
Joined 13 Mar 2002
1909 posts
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Sorry to say my advice has not changed from earlier, you cannot pull said van with your vehicle, this is because of it's width. More to the point the boys in blue have picked up on this and are currently enforcing this rule with their usual vigour.
from earlier:-
Robert is actually breaking the law and his insurance would most likely be invalid if he had an accident. The problem is not so much that the Disco cannot do the job more that the law has not caught up. The law says the towing vehicle must be a commercial one of 3.5 tons gross which means in practice a van of 2 tons with a 1.5 ton payload as the sprinter and long wheelbase Transits are, and the Disco is not.
As for the disco's 3.5 ton towing limit, this is the test weight that it can pull up a 1 in 4 ramp from a standing start without putting an undue load on the clutch etc, and therefore would bear no resemblance to real motoring and how it could control such a mass in an emergency.
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hobby caravans again
13 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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In reply to the other messages, as I am in the process of buying a Hobby 650UMFe twin axle I contacted Cleveland Police with regards to the width restrictions of the towed vehicle, and they informed me that it is quite legal to tow a caravan as long as it's width does not exceed 2.9mtrs. The only thing to be aware of is that being German that the lighting and braking systems come up to british standards
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hobby caravans again
13 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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deke
Joined 10 Feb 2003
20 posts
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Do you intend to tow it with a commercial vehicle.
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hobby caravans again
13 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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No I will be towing with a Vauxhall Monteray[Isuzu Trooper], The maximum towing weight of this is 3300Kgs, and the mass in ready to drive is 1613Kgs of the Hobby so no problems there
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hobby caravans again
13 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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gary
Joined 13 Mar 2002
1909 posts
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George, There still seems to be some confusion here. Cleveland police information while not incorrect is misleading for your purposes. 2.9m is the maximum width allowed without notifying the police of your intention of taking such a wide load on the highway, I say load because it should be on the back of a Truck and in the case of a caravan, how many times have you seen a static caravan towed?. Further, if it is OK to pull these wide vans in the UK, then don't you think British manufactures would be building them??? and not sticking to 2.3M which IS the LIMIT you can tow with ANY 4X4 with the exception of a LONG wheelbase Landrover which is classed as a COMMERCIAL vehicle.
Sorry to be so forceful, but all I am trying to do is save you grief.
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hobby caravans again
13 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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Gary
You say this information is misleading, as 2.9Mtrs is the maximum width before advising the Police of taking a load onto a highway, lets not forget that the Hobby that I am thinking of buying is only 2.5Mtrs[8Ft.4Inches] wide,Also when you say about not seeing a static being towed, the minimum width I know of, of a static is 10Ft.[3.05Mtrs]wide, which is above the 2.9Mtr restriction, this is probably why they have to be carried on a low loader
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hobby caravans again
14 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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Sorry Gary I have double checked and you are right , It appears that the policeman that I spoke to wasnt totally up on the towing regulations and I have again phoned the police to make sure before taking delivery of the hobby, so I am going to cancel the order and I will have to look around for a decent sized English caravan, sorry if you thought I was being cocky but I was hoping that advice from the police was correct, thank you all for in the first place putting some doubt in my mind to make enquiries I would have been up the old creek without a paddle. I am slightly annoyed that the dealer either wasnt aware of the regs or wasnt telling me, once again thank you very much
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hobby caravans again
14 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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deke
Joined 10 Feb 2003
20 posts
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george i really hate to have to tell you this but 2.5 meters is strictly speaking illegal on our roads unless towed with a commercial vehicle. For the past two weeks we have agonised over whether to take the risk and buy a hobby 560kmfe because we love the van so much, the legal limit is 2.3 meters wide, and i know its unfair, and i know they are legal on the continent,etc, we have been to a number of caravan dealers who would quite happily have sold us this van knowing precisley what we intended to tow it with, which only served to strenghthen our feelings that it must be o.k, But it is'nt. Its a matter of a few inches and it seems so unfair. good luck to you if you intend to go ahead anyway but double check your insurance, this is the aspect of it that really frightened us, being pulled over by the cops is one thing, but having a non valid insurance in the case of an accident not good news. deke
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hobby caravans again
14 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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I have to apologise to everyone especially Gary as it appears that I was given the wrong information by the police, because I again double checked with the police and was directed to the traffic division and the legal width is 2.3 unless the towing vehicle is over 3.5 tons in weight, as a result I am either going to cancel the order for the caravan or permantly site it which I am still contemplating as I and my wife have fallen in love with the hobby it is one of the most beautiful vans we have seen, the little extras really make it, again sorry if my information gave anyone the wrong idea its only that I was believed that if anyone would know it would be the police. Any way deke have you seen the 500KMFe this is very similar layout to the 560KMFe but is only 2.3Mtrs wide
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hobby caravans again
16 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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gary
Joined 13 Mar 2002
1909 posts
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No need to apologise,we got a result in the end. How on earth did we ever get along without the internet?
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hobby caravans again
17 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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deke
Joined 10 Feb 2003
20 posts
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We know just how you feel george, sorry to be the bearer of such bad tidings, we are indeed now looking for a hobby 500kmfe which although a little smaller will be an excellent van with a decent sized awning attached. We have researched the insurance issue, because as you may or may not know a large number of caravan insurers refuse to cover hobby or lmc vans because they are So desirable and are apparently a magnet for theives. We got by far and away the best quote from the farmers union 08457045031 but in truth i could only find 3 companies which would cover them at all.
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hobby caravans again
19 February 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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Well we went ahead and bought the hobby 650 umfe as its such a lovely van we decided to site it permanent for the time being and you never know we may come into line with the eec over the width of the caravans we can tow,then we can then tour with it because we will, because its new be keeping it for quite a few years. I have been a bit naughty and I towed the van with my vauxhall monteray from where i bought it to our home and also from there to the site we will be keeping it, a total distance of over one hundred miles, i did pass quite a few police cars on the way and they never even bothered, by the way the van towed beautifully. as for insurance deke we got a quote from the caravan club for £374, but we opted for a quote from another company with a quote of £307 and this included 25% of the caravan value for awning and contents i cant remember the name till they send the shedule but the phone no is 020 86633939, and both these had no qwarms about insuring a hobby as long as the security measures were adhered to, hope this might interest you deke
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hobby caravans again
3 March 2003, 0:00 AM
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SO
Joined 3 Mar 2003
5 posts
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Beware!
some private sellers and dealers will sell you a wide Hobby caravan which is illegal to tow in UK and would invalidate your insurance in case of accident.
They will not tell you this before you part with your money!!
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hobby caravans again
29 April 2003, 0:00 AM
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Mickey
Joined 29 Apr 2003
2 posts
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We are also very interested in buying a hobby, and have looked at various sizes etc. We need quite a large van as we are a couple with 3 kids, and the hobby is ideal. I heard about various UK laws regarding towing the hobby and was assured by each seller it was ok to tow them, including the big 6 berth ones!! We drive a Land Rover Discovery and was also told we would have no bother at all with that either. Please could you tell us which van we can pull legally with this vehicle. Thanks.
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hobby caravans again
29 April 2003, 0:00 AM
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George
Joined 13 Feb 2003
18 posts
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Hi mickey the largest van you would be able to get and tow legally even with your discovery is any of the 540 models which have a body length of 6.17mtrs but have a body width of 2.3mtrs, there is a variety of interior layouts which if you contact http://www.hobbycaravans.de they will send you brochures [i am afraid they are in german]hope this has been of some help
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hobby caravans again
7 May 2003, 0:00 AM
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Dibble
Joined 7 May 2003
2 posts
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I'm sure all this towing marlarky, affects my Human Rights, or it is a Trade embargo within the EU, interesting thoughts, anyone want to give ie a go.
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hobby caravans again
10 May 2003, 0:00 AM
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steve
Joined 10 May 2003
1 posts
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Thanks to the Internet and you good people I saved myself a lot of grief.
We were just about to purchase a Hobby 560 when I stumbled across your discussion. We had been assured that the 560 was OK to tow with our Discovery, "...it's only the big twin axles that are a problem. The single axles are all legal....."
Needless to say we haven't gone ahead but are now the proud owners of a 540UF which is OK. Just out of interest, I rang about half a dozen dealers who were advertising Hobby (or other German)vans and only one asked me what I was intending to tow it with. When pressed, the others pleaded ignorance or said things like "..They are legal in Germany and now we're all part of the EEC...." or "...technically there's an issue but nobody has ever actually been prosecuted....".
On the subject of insurance I've had no problem getting it sorted. There are a few companies who won't insure any non-British Caravan but that's their choice. Often, these same companies won't insure you if the van is too old or if you've had a claim or if you happen to have the wrong postcode etc. etc. so it isn't just German vans they don't like, it's anybody who might make a claim !
You did make me a bit paranoid about storage though so we've found somewhere with secure manned indoor storage. Of course when we take it away we'll probably be too scared to leave it but I suppose that means we'll have a relaxing time lounging about in the van
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